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Old 01-23-2019, 11:01 PM   #1
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Politics Trashing the System

Wow, the Democrats are really trashing the joint as they set new lows for partisanship:

Democrats House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said today she will not allow Donald Trump to deliver the State of the Union Address in the House of Representatives next week if the government remains closed.

Stopping the president from speaking? Really?

Are the Democrats prepared for the same disrespect and the same de-platforming of the next Democrat president?

It seems increasingly clear that the great new challenge from moderates on both sides of politics is to resist the new culture of hatred and exclusion of opponents - a culture that threatens democracy.

Just as a matter of curiosity, doesn't this contravene Trump's right to free speech?
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:00 AM   #2
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But I'm sure it will some how be trumps fault.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:35 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASHSON
Wow, the Democrats are really trashing the joint as they set new lows for partisanship:

Democrats House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said today she will not allow Donald Trump to deliver the State of the Union Address in the House of Representatives next week if the government remains closed.

Stopping the president from speaking? Really?

Are the Democrats prepared for the same disrespect and the same de-platforming of the next Democrat president?

It seems increasingly clear that the great new challenge from moderates on both sides of politics is to resist the new culture of hatred and exclusion of opponents - a culture that threatens democracy.

Just as a matter of curiosity, doesn't this contravene Trump's right to free speech?
He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it. What's more of a concern is that he's Constitutionally required to communicate to Congress the state of the Union, but there's plenty of precedent for methods other than directly speaking, including writing a letter if somebody can get him enough paper and crayons.

As far as respect goes, the bright side of not giving the speech in Congress is that nobody's going to shout "You lie!" at him.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:36 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by ASHSON
Wow, the Democrats are really trashing the joint as they set new lows for partisanship:

Democrats House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said today she will not allow Donald Trump to deliver the State of the Union Address in the House of Representatives next week if the government remains closed.

Stopping the president from speaking? Really?

Are the Democrats prepared for the same disrespect and the same de-platforming of the next Democrat president?

It seems increasingly clear that the great new challenge from moderates on both sides of politics is to resist the new culture of hatred and exclusion of opponents - a culture that threatens democracy.

Just as a matter of curiosity, doesn't this contravene Trump's right to free speech?

Funny on so many levels
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Old 01-24-2019, 09:05 AM   #5
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He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it.
No, it's not. The house belongs to Congress and the American people. Pelosi is only there to control the debates on the floor and things like that. She is the Speaker, not the owner, and she's assuming powers that aren't hers.
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Old 01-24-2019, 10:27 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASHSON
Wow, the Democrats are really trashing the joint as they set new lows for partisanship:

Democrats House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said today she will not allow Donald Trump to deliver the State of the Union Address in the House of Representatives next week if the government remains closed.

Stopping the president from speaking? Really?

Are the Democrats prepared for the same disrespect and the same de-platforming of the next Democrat president?

It seems increasingly clear that the great new challenge from moderates on both sides of politics is to resist the new culture of hatred and exclusion of opponents - a culture that threatens democracy.

Just as a matter of curiosity, doesn't this contravene Trump's right to free speech?
He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it. What's more of a concern is that he's Constitutionally required to communicate to Congress the state of the Union, but there's plenty of precedent for methods other than directly speaking, including writing a letter if somebody can get him enough paper and crayons.

As far as respect goes, the bright side of not giving the speech in Congress is that nobody's going to shout "You lie!" at him.


Why is it a concern that he is required to speak to congress. No where does the constitution say he needs to deliver an annual address. It only says that he “shall from time to time” report to Congress on the state of the nation and recommend any measures to take.

Pelosi may have screwed everyone on this. Trump could keep congress in the dark from here on out because of her actions.
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Old 01-24-2019, 10:38 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by ASHSON
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it.
No, it's not. The house belongs to Congress and the American people. Pelosi is only there to control the debates on the floor and things like that. She is the Speaker, not the owner, and she's assuming powers that aren't hers.


Actually she does controls the house. That means lights, security, camera, locked doors and so on. She can't exactly stop trump, but she could end the session, turn off the lights and cameras and go home. Only the people that remained behind would hear his speech.
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Old 01-24-2019, 12:53 PM   #8
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Again, the Aussie seems to know and understand more about US politics than the average lefty American.

It is not Pelosi's house. That house belongs to the American people. But, both Trump and Pelosi are playing political games.

Today, Trump said he would delay the SOTU. That's fine. But, he should have given it at the WH with a small representative audience. That was an option, too.

People are tired of the shutdown. Mostly tired of hearing about it. And, its all a case of confirmation bias at this point. If you are more on Trump's side, you blame Pelosi for not truly negotiating. "I'll give you $1 for the wall" is not negotiating.

If you are anti-Trump, you side with Pelosi who says "open the government and we'll negotiate". Although, she basically said even if he opens the government, she's not giving any money for the wall.

So, we wait for the silly games to end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ASHSON
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it.
No, it's not. The house belongs to Congress and the American people. Pelosi is only there to control the debates on the floor and things like that. She is the Speaker, not the owner, and she's assuming powers that aren't hers.
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Old 01-24-2019, 01:17 PM   #9
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this just shows how the democrats are like children, throwing temper tantrums
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Old 01-24-2019, 03:39 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by ASHSON
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
He's got a right to speak, but it's Representative Pelosi's House and he is not welcome to speak to it.
No, it's not. The house belongs to Congress and the American people. Pelosi is only there to control the debates on the floor and things like that. She is the Speaker, not the owner, and she's assuming powers that aren't hers.
No, she does have this power.
Quote:
As speaker, it is Pelosi's prerogative to invite the President to deliver the annual address. Both the House and the Senate would need to pass resolutions convening a Joint Session of Congress before the President's appearance.
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Old 01-24-2019, 04:30 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASHSON
No, it's not. The house belongs to Congress and the American people. Pelosi is only there to control the debates on the floor and things like that. She is the Speaker, not the owner, and she's assuming powers that aren't hers.
No, she does have this power.
Quote:
As speaker, it is Pelosi's prerogative to invite the President to deliver the annual address. Both the House and the Senate would need to pass resolutions convening a Joint Session of Congress before the President's appearance.

When, Exactly, did CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?
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Old 01-24-2019, 04:36 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by iron_warmonger
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
No, she does have this power.
Quote:
As speaker, it is Pelosi's prerogative to invite the President to deliver the annual address. Both the House and the Senate would need to pass resolutions convening a Joint Session of Congress before the President's appearance.

When, Exactly, did CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?
Take your pick, then.
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Old 01-24-2019, 05:35 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by darthbob88
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Originally Posted by iron_warmonger
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When, Exactly, did CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?
Take your pick, then.

You did not answer my question, "CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?" I did not asked for a large number of other news outlet opinion of how Pelosi action are OK, I asked when did new outlets become arbitrator of the law of the U.S.? So can you provide a link to were U.S. Law says she has this right?

My fav. of the sourced that came from you link is the Guardian. It says you are right, but that is a UK based news paper, so how do they have any say in how U.S. law is applied? I believe that ended on July 4th 1776!
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Old 01-24-2019, 06:32 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by iron_warmonger

When, Exactly, did CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?
Take your pick, then.

You did not answer my question, "CNN become the final arbitrator of American Law?" I did not asked for a large number of other news outlet opinion of how Pelosi action are OK, I asked when did new outlets become arbitrator of the law of the U.S.? So can you provide a link to were U.S. Law says she has this right?
Ah, well in answer to your actual question, when news sources became more accessible than all 53 Goddamned titles of the USC. If you want to do the legwork yourself and find out about all the legislation that needs to be passed and invoked for the President to give a speech to a joint session of Congress, I'm not going to stop you. In the meantime, I'll assume CNN knows what it's talking about.
Quote:
My fav. of the sourced that came from you link is the Guardian. It says you are right, but that is a UK based news paper, so how do they have any say in how U.S. law is applied? I believe that ended on July 4th 1776!
You seem to confuse "having a say in" with "having understanding of". I'm not a British citizen, but I understand that PM May is facing a no-confidence vote which might see her ousted.
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Old 01-24-2019, 07:35 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by darthbob88
... In the meantime, I'll assume CNN knows what it's talking about...

That explains a lot.
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Old 01-24-2019, 07:40 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by AtticBat
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Originally Posted by darthbob88
... In the meantime, I'll assume CNN knows what it's talking about...

That explains a lot.
Would you rather I'd gone with Daily Kos saying that Pelosi should have invited Trump, but for an impeachment hearing instead of SOTU?
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Food stamps stimulate the economy, tax cuts don't, tax rates are at a historic low, welfare queens are either non-existent or embarrassingly near.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:23 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by AtticBat

That explains a lot.
Would you rather I'd gone with Daily Kos saying that Pelosi should have invited Trump, but for an impeachment hearing instead of SOTU?

I never assume anyone knows what they’re talking about.
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Old 01-24-2019, 09:01 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by AtticBat
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
Would you rather I'd gone with Daily Kos saying that Pelosi should have invited Trump, but for an impeachment hearing instead of SOTU?

I never assume anyone knows what they’re talking about.
How do you function in modern society if you insist on fact-checking every claim yourself?
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Facts or GTFO. Anecdotal arguments will be met with mockery.
Food stamps stimulate the economy, tax cuts don't, tax rates are at a historic low, welfare queens are either non-existent or embarrassingly near.
My posting is a PC-Optional zone. I reserve the right to refrain from using PC euphemisms, and to speak my opinion, fucknut.
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Old 01-24-2019, 09:22 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by darthbob88
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Originally Posted by AtticBat

I never assume anyone knows what they’re talking about.
How do you function in modern society if you insist on fact-checking every claim yourself?

I ignore a lot of bullshit. There are a lot of people out there lying through their teeth. I trust my instincts. I’m usually right, not always, but enough to go by. Most of what’s going on is obvious. I listen to all sides and make my decision based on my experience.
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Old 01-24-2019, 09:34 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by AtticBat
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthbob88
How do you function in modern society if you insist on fact-checking every claim yourself?

I ignore a lot of bullshit. There are a lot of people out there lying through their teeth. I trust my instincts. I’m usually right, not always, but enough to go by. Most of what’s going on is obvious. I listen to all sides and make my decision based on my experience.
Oh shit, I forgot, you're the asshole who doesn't trust anything outside your own head.
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Asking Republicans to run government is like asking a vegetarian to cook a steak. They can't do it well if they don't think it should be done at all.
Facts or GTFO. Anecdotal arguments will be met with mockery.
Food stamps stimulate the economy, tax cuts don't, tax rates are at a historic low, welfare queens are either non-existent or embarrassingly near.
My posting is a PC-Optional zone. I reserve the right to refrain from using PC euphemisms, and to speak my opinion, fucknut.
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